Blog Assignment

Saturday, May 18, 2019

Week 17: A Woman's Right: Anti-Abortion Law Passed in Alabama





Summary

On Wednesday, May 15th, 2019, the Alabama State senate passed anti-abortion into law. The law effectively banns abortion, by making it a felony to follow through with the procedure. Further punishing those who participate in the act up to life in prison. However, the law only provides certain exceptions to the few dealing with health risks. With additional Democratic attempts to add an amendment to exempt victims of rape and incest, several have failed in the process.


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Alabama's Governor Kay Ivey, claims that her actions contributed to a greater cause, as "this legislation stands as a powerful testament to Alabamians' deeply held belief that every life is precious and that every life is a sacred gift from God." Yet Ivey also mentions that the new law has potential to be unenforced, due to specific legalized decisions during 1973. Overall, the bill has most certainly sparked continuous controversy between the woman of our society.


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Reaction

After first receiving the news about this idea, I was really at a point of disbelief. Because I feel that this bill is addressing more than the aspect of pro-life, that it more-so affects quite the opposite in fact. For instance if a women living in unhealthy conditions were to undergo a nine month pregnancy, she is then left with two choices to make after giving birth. To either place her child under foster care, which is horrible for the child's sake, or provide for her child with the needs of government assistance, forcing legislatures to complain about government assisted programs not having the opportunity to contribute to other liabilities with financial support.



Connection

This correlates to our South Africa Unit in how certain laws affected the personal decisions and life choices of its society. During the late 1940's, a specific set of restrictions were enforced that would limit the possibility of equal well-being for all. Consequently enough, this would only resolve to future dispute and controversy over apartheid laws and procedures.



Questions

1) Should abortion be a woman's choice?

2) What is your input on the restrictive laws potentially being up to life in prison and the death penalty?














61 comments:

  1. Abortion should be the female's choice because they are the ones who have to hold the baby for nine months, they are the ones who have to feed and tend to the baby, they are the ones who have to worry if the child has all the things a child needs in order to thrive in the future, so why does the government get to decide whether women will keep their babies or not if they aren't going to be there to take care of the baby. Abortion however in my eyes is still murder but if the woman believes that she thinks that death is a better choice for the child than her taking care of it, that's her choice. There shouldn't be any restrictive laws in the first place but being sent to prison for life and the death penalty are pretty harsh punishments for a choice that should be personal and have no government affiliation in the first place.

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  2. Personally, I believe that abortion should be a woman's choice. Other people have no right on what a woman wants to do with her body. There are many reasons why a woman would want an abortion and not letting her get one is just horrible. Even if a new life is brought into this world, if there isn't anyone to take care of it, the child will end up in foster care, causing even more legal issues with the government and so on. And actually, according to the Guttmacher Institute by the age of 45, almost 1 in 4 women get an abortion, most of identifying with a religion. Punishing a woman for getting an abortion is even more cruel as death penalty and life imprisonment are beyond morally correct.

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  3. Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, Kentucky, Mississippi, Missouri, Ohio, and Utah are trying to pass new abortion laws.These places are mainly trying to pass heartbeat bills. This is a bill that restricts abortions after a baby’s heartbeat is detected. It is commonly cited that this happens as early as 6 weeks in, but the New York Times states that this happens around 8 weeks into the pregnancy.
    There are a few main reasons that have sparked the eight states to try and put more restrictions on abortions. The main reason is Justice Brett Kavanaugh’s appointment to the supreme court. These bills all aim to pass state legislatures. After that, democrats will suffer the tough choice of having the bill pass through the state and banning abortion in just a state or appealing and having the bill face the supreme court. However, bringing the bill to the supreme court comes with the risk of overturning the 1973 bill, Roe v. Wade. However, this is not particularly necessary. If the judges want to try to overturn Roe v. Wade they can choose to debate any of over a dozen bills waiting for the supreme court, according to Vox.
    All seven states that are attempting to pass bills restricting abortions are ruled by a republican trifecta. These are governments where one party has the majority of the house, senate, and the governor is affiliated with that party. This allows them not to fear backlash because they are firmly supported inside their state. One of these states, Utah, is the longest running trifecta; Utah has been ruled by the republican party since 1985. This led the states to believe that the heartbeat bills would make it past state legislatures and into the supreme court where they could possibly overturn Roe v. Wade.
    A liberal news outlet, MSNBC, states that if Roe v. Wade is overturned that rich women will go to New York or California for abortions, but the poor women will be forced to participate in back room abortions. At this point abortions are not cheap either. According to Planned Parenthood, abortions cost between $350 and and $950 dollars for abortions in the first trimester. This is only about 12 weeks so a mere 4 weeks after the restrictions from heartbeat bills. Poor women could already struggle because not all health care covers abortions and any health care in the US is very expensive.
    According to the CDC use of contraceptives increased by five times between 2002 and 2012. This increase seems to be related to the decrease in abortions in the US overall. Abortions have decreased by nearly 400,000 overall per year since 1996. Increasing prevalence of contraceptives decreases the amount of abortions that women get.
    Women say that they cannot have the baby because they cannot afford it. They will be forced to place the baby into the US foster care system which they do not want on their conscience. The Children’s Law Center of California states that over ⅓ of children leave the foster care system without a high school diploma or GED. They also say that 63% of women and 22% of men get food stamps after exiting the foster care system. I completely agree that this a problem. There needs to be a much larger focus on fixing the foster care system in the US.
    Unfortunately, I was not able to find recent information on why people get abortions. However, a 2004 study from the Guttmacher institute found only 1% of people cited rape and less than 0.5% cited incest as one of the reasons. I believe this evidence helps to demonstrate that the bill in Alabama is overly restrictive. This could be because it has the goal of trying to overturn Roe v. Wade rather than stop abortions for less than 1.5% of the population.

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    1. Additionally, about 42% cited a reason for abortion as unmarried status while 38% cited a reason as a child would interfere with either an education or a career. These issues can all be solved by improving the foster care system. According to Child Welfare Information Gateway, 49% of foster care kids ended up reunified with their birth parents. Improving this rate would allow parents who would otherwise get an abortion to send their child into foster care and pursue their personal goals before possibly reunifying with their child as an adult. However, before that occurs the foster care system needs to improve and help kids become more self-reliant and focus on them getting an education.
      Time magazine says that if Roe v. Wade is overturned that “we can expect many of the old methods of enforcement to be re-enacted.” They reference Cook County Hospital in Chicago which had 5,000 beds for women who attempted to perform abortions on themselves or went to people who were not professionals to get an abortion. Time magazine also talks about the methods of enforcement saying that “police and prosecutors threatened, arrested, interrogated, investigated and occasionally prosecuted women for the crime of abortion. Police and doctors routinely questioned women who miscarried to determine if they’d had an abortion.” Obviously, these methods are horrible. However, improving the foster care system would allow people to put their children into a foster care system rather than aborting them. Additionally, Alabama’s law criminalizing abortion was enacted over 25 years before radio was discovered and a few years before Wyoming became the first state to allow women to vote. At this time things that seem horrific to us now were commonplace across the whole US. It seems clear to me that interrogating women with miscarriages would not stand now.
      Previous commenters that were pro-choice argue that the alternative of the foster care system is not good. I agree with this. I support improving the quality of the foster care system in the US with increased attention on education and reunification with parents. Alabama’s bill outlawing abortion is far too restrictive. I believe the correct solution is to adopt abortion law similar to Finland (abortion-clinics.eu/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Finland_CB12AB72.doc-Pub_AbortionlegislationinEuropeIPPFEN_Feb2009.pdf) and improve the foster care system throughout the whole US.

      docs.google.com/document/d/1205l8IBEg-eeJ0zuIEXT0dXltjEtksbOqyWEcHN6CWo/edit?usp=sharing

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    2. Here is something pretty important that I forgot to add. In 2014, a survey of over 8,000 abortion patients from 87 different facilities found 45% of patients had already had an abortion. Additionally, the study found that patients were significantly more likely to get an abortion the closer they lived to the facility. For patients over 100 miles only 32% had a prior abortion. I find this extremely discomforting as it seems to point to abortion being used as a form of contraception or people using abortion due to convenience.

      www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5771530/
      docs.google.com/document/d/1205l8IBEg-eeJ0zuIEXT0dXltjEtksbOqyWEcHN6CWo/edit?usp=sharing

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  4. Without a doubt, women should have the choice to choose abortion. They are the ones that have to carry the child and should do what they think is best. A good example of why abortions should be allowed is because the mom could be too young and does not have a stable source of income. And when the baby comes out, the mom will not be able to support her or the kid and that could lead to child neglect. My input on the death penalty and to be sentenced to jail for life, is that there should be no punishment. If the mom goes through with an abortion, and is to get punished for it, there should be none because it's already hard enough on the mom to go through that.

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  5. Abortion absolutely should be legalized, not just because it should be a woman's choice and human right in the 21st century to carry out a pregnancy to term or not, but because criminalizing abortion will *not* make abortions stop occurring. According to the Guttmacher Institute (a bipartisan organization researching sexual health and policy issues (sourced from the Atlantic)), the rates of abortion in countries that criminalize or restrict abortion are about the same as in countries that legalize it (37 in 1000 women vs. 34 in 1000 women); the only difference is that women in countries that criminalize or restrict abortion get the treatment using illegal and most often wildly unsafe means. Making abortion illegal will not prevent abortion; it will simply push desperate women to risk their own lives to not have to give birth to a baby they don't want or that could kill them anyway. It's extremely ironic to me that a movement that seeks to "save human lives" is pushing for a policy that will indirectly cause more deaths.
    Source: https://www.guttmacher.org/news-release/2018/new-report-highlights-worldwide-variations-abortion-incidence-and-safety

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  6. I think that legalizing abortion is a very controversial subject to talk about. That being said I think it would be tough for many women to be forced to carry a child, especially if they are too young or aren't ready. Legalizing abortion would give the choice to women bearing a child to decide whether they are ready for a child or not. However if Alabama really follows that every life is precious then in addition to respecting women's choices about abortions they could set up an alternative law about it. The alternative law could target women who are old enough and have the financial stability to raise a child and make it illegal for them to have an abortion. I think these restrictive laws and punishments should stop. If abortion is illegal and someone goes through with it, they must have a very good reason to have to give up a baby even when it was illegal. Of course if any law surrounding abortion is to work there will have to be some penance to deter people from having an abortion

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  7. Abortion is one of the most hotly debated topics not only in America but around the world, so naturally when Alabama’s new bill regarding it it sparked a lot of outrage as well as approval. I’m sure most of you have seen tweets and posts about it claiming that a rapist now receives a lighter sentence than a woman that gets an abortion and women can be thrown into jail for getting an abortion or suffering a miscarriage. According to the legislature, abortion is now classified as a Class A felony, which can receive up to 99 years same as rape. If a woman does get an abortion illegally, she will not be arrested and jailed; the doctor who performed it will be. Some people say that men should not be making laws about women’s bodies but the governor who signed in the bill is a woman herself. Common arguments used by pro choicers is “it’s just a clump of cells” “my body my choice” and “What about victims of rape and incest, or if the mother’s life is in danger?” Upon conception the “clump of cells” already has its own unique DNA, and its sex, hair color, body type, etc have all been determined. If the fetus is really a part of a woman’s body, then a woman has two sets of DNA, and as the baby develops, two heads, four legs, four arms, etc. In reality, rape and incest makes up of less than one percent of abortions, same as abortions performed to save the mother’s life. Even if rape or incest cases occupied a larger percentage of abortions, is more violence the answer to assuaging the woman’s pain? Does the conception of a child determine their worth? In New York the worst of criminals cannot be put to death but a baby can be aborted at any stage. Some children may be born into poverty or foster care but is death preferable to difficulties you may face in life? Children that are born out of violence or into poverty have a right to live as much as anyone else. Killing an innocent life is not ”a woman’s right” or “feminist”; in fact Susan B Anthony opposes abortion herself. Instead of being told by everyone around her to end the life growing inside of her in the name of “empowerment” women deserve the support she needs in order to ensure a physically and mentally healthy pregnancy for herself and her baby.

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    1. The comment replies to common pro-choice arguments involving clumps of cells, personal choice, and victim’s. The comment says upon conception the clump of cells already has its own DNA, but that doesn’t really negate the fact that it is still just a clump of cells. Every cell in our bodies can code for genes related to sex and other traits and so simply having genes for this does not make this group of cells special. In fact, even cancerous cells have these traits, and cancerous cells proliferate uncontrolled by the host, just like a fetus does. So, yes upon conception it really is just a clump of cells. In fact this clump of cells has a negative impact on the woman's body, because the fetus steals oxygen and nutrients from the mother. As for being a part of the women’s body; the fetus is attached to the mother via the umbilical cord. And even if you still believe it is separate, why should a woman be forced to carry a parasite in her own body? Whether or not it’s a part of the woman that she wants removed, or a parasite growing inside her, she should have the right to choose whether or not it is allowed to steal her nutrients and cause her immense pain in the future. Also, the comment brings up the fact that a low percentage of abortions are performed to save a woman’s life, but fails to mention what will happen to those women now. Under the current law these women will either need to do an illegal abortion or they will die. This is clearly not right, you shouldn't need to break the law in order to survive. Also, in the case of rape, I see one clear way of looking at it: Someone forced something into them and it’s growing, and I see abortion as a way of removing that thing that was forced into them, simple as that. Regardless of what that thing could turn into it, it’s not that yet and the women has no obligation to keep it in them. Furthermore, the comment says that in New York the worst of criminals cannot be put to death, but a baby can be aborted at any stage, except that’s not true. It’s physically impossible to abort a “baby” because the word baby refers to a small human from the age of birth to about 4 years of age, not to a fetus in a woman’s womb. While this may seem nitpicky, using the word baby is very deceiving, because a baby is out in the world and independent, while a fetus is still stealing from the woman and dependent on the woman. The main reason that I personally believe that abortions should be a woman’s choice is because giving birth is extremely painful and should never be forced upon anyone. Whether or not the fetus is “innocent” doesn’t matter. The woman should not be forced by the government to undergo a painful procedure even if it’s necessary for the fetus to live.

      https://www.verywellfamily.com/difference-between-baby-newborn-infant-toddler-293848

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  8. With having a parent who is an OBGYN I truly believe that women have the choice whether or not they want an abortion. I do not think it is fair for someone or a law to limit their choice about having an abortion. Every women has their own reason for an abortion and I think people need to accept it and not criticize them. Many people view an abortion as a negative thing because they do not see the full picture. I understand that abortions are not a positive concept to talk or think about but they need to be recognized and not abolished. The restrictive laws are truly outrageous and I definitely do not support them. Other people should not be controlling someones rights and need to let them make their own choices. There should not be any consequences for wanting to abort a baby no matter the reason.

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  9. Abortion is very tricky subject that is definitely in the spotlight at the moment in the US. Now personally I am in the middle, but I don’t really view this law as a law meant to degrade and harm women but rather a law to protect people who cannot protect themselves. Around 6 weeks into pregnancy is when most women find out that they are pregnant (https://americanpregnancy.org/week-by-week/5-weeks-pregnant/) and around 6 weeks into pregnancy is when a fetal heartbeat is usually detected. At this point I believe that there is a seperate being or person inside the mother with there own heartbeat and set of DNA. Just 8 weeks into pregnancy the fetus already has ears that are forming, bones that are forming, toes and fingers that are growing along with small details such as they already have eyelashes along with the baby’s muscles can now contract. Because of these facts I don’t believe the fetus is just a clump of cells at this point. Now I understand that pregnancies are not always planned but to abort a baby just out of inconvenience doesn’t seem proportionate to me. It is very rare that abortions occur for medical reasons but rather the worry of the burden that baby could have on your life is a much more common reason. Is it really ok to kill a baby for personal gain or just to ensure you can move ahead with your career? When it comes to medical reasons for abortion that is a completely different story and conversation to have. In New York it is legal to have an abortion at any time during a pregnancy. Now what is the difference if a woman decides to have an abortion a week before birth and or the baby is killed an hour after it is born. One is deemed moral based on the laws of New York and the other is considered murder. The only thing that separates these two scenarios is 1 week. What makes the baby any less human whether it is in or outside of the womb. When it comes to jail time the actual law is that the doctor who performs the procedure can recieve jail time not the mother. Many say the right to an abortion is a constitutional right. But in the constitution it says every person has a right to “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” life being the most important one. So why should anyone have the right to take away the right of “life” from an unborn baby.

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  10. Abortion is definitely a woman’s choice. This can be argued from several aspects. Some pro-life individuals argue that babies are babies, and that they are lives too. However, if the premature heart inside the womb deserves the right to live, the mom should have rights as well. It’s extremely hilarious how a six-weeks-old heart has more choices and rights than the women. As some people mentioned before, women doesn’t always choose to become pregnant. Some teenagers can be raped, and some might be financially incapable to having a child. Being able to control when to have a child is a normal choice everyone should be able to make. I personally do not understand why the government even started to oppose abortion. Some people have babies that are abnormal since fertilization. When ultrasound results come out, they are unable to survive after birth. However, people can tolerate the life to keep growing and eventually die after the mom experiences labor pain, but can’t tolerate having the baby removed before it dies. It is more ridiculous that rapists and women raped are facing the same consequences. Some people are advocating sex strikes to protest, however, I don’t think this is a good solution. Not having sex will not be a strong enough protest that concerns the government, since it doesn’t have any short term extreme damages. In my opinion, the only way to protest is to copy what happened during apartheid. If protests are able to reach international awareness and make major trading countries such as China stop trading, America might change their decisions. Another possible end to this crisis is the stepping down of Donald Trump. If the new president respects women more, they might change the laws and save the country.

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    1. A 6-week old fetus does not have more rights than the mother. The fetus cannot vote, or choose their religion, or bear arms, or have freedom of speech, or have due process of law, or have their basic human rights not infringed upon, or, if they were legal, get an abortion. The comment says that rape is a reason for abortion. I strongly believe that victims of rape should be allowed an abortion. However, only 1% of people who got an abortion cited rape as the reason. This is a very small subset and an amendment should be introduced in the bill to fix this flaw. Further, the comment says that another reason for abortion if financial stress. However, I do not see this as a reason to get rid of possible future life. I believe that this reason could be easily solved by improving the foster care system in the US. After this, women would not be worried about their child not getting an education or living a difficult life. The comment also says that children dying directly after birth is a large concern. In 2013, only 0.28% of children died the day they were born. And, this year made the headlines considering that the 11,300 children dying the day of birth was worse than Egypt and Turkey. Moreover, rapists and women raped do not face the same consequences in Alabama. Doctors that perform abortions receive the same punishment as rapists in Alabama, a class A felony for both. Finally, I believe protesting abortion like apartheid was protested is a bad idea. It would require US citizens to ask other countries not to trade with the US. Why would US citizens want to hurt their own economy? Additionally, we have seen the US economy bring down the world economy in 2007 and it would not be good to encourage that happening again. Ultimately, the foster care system needs to be improved and the Alabama law needs to allow for abortions in special cases like rapes or danger to the parents and the punishment on doctors should also be lessened.

      docs.google.com/document/d/1205l8IBEg-eeJ0zuIEXT0dXltjEtksbOqyWEcHN6CWo/edit?usp=sharing

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  11. Before I explain why abortion is a woman’s right, I will briefly explain the intended role of the American Government in our country. When our founding fathers were creating the government, they said that the role of the government would be to strictly “establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our posterity." To summarize, the government was simply supposed to oversee that everything in our country was just and it was to step in if any aspect of the citizens’ lives were becoming destructive to themselves and/or others. Therefore, banning abortion is essentially an overstepping of the government’s power. This ban is not due to making something unjust just, or to promote general welfare for Americans. It is simply due to the fact that a group of people stand against abortion. Every opinion should be valued, so the pro-abortion and con-abortion opinions should both be valued equally. However, it is not acceptable to force a certain belief or opinion on a community where the opinions clearly differ from person to person. Moreover, it is certainly not the government’s right to do so-- this is a fact since the Founding Fathers’ “role of the government” definition stands against the actions that the government of Alabama took. Therefore, abortion should be a woman’s choice.

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    1. According to Encyclopedia Britannica: “Roe v. Wade, [the] legal case in which the U.S. Supreme Court on January 22, 1973, ruled (7–2) that unduly restrictive state regulation of abortion is unconstitutional.” The US government is the government that once said state restriction of abortions is not allowed. Additionally, at this point states are the ones attempting to restrict abortion, not the government. If the case made it to the Supreme Court and the conservative court decided to restrict abortions it should be the same as them deciding to allow abortions. In 1973, the Supreme Court decided that a state restriction of abortions would be equivalent to restricting the right of privacy or the “right to be let alone.” They found Texas’s laws criminalizing abortion violated the fourteenth amendment to the US Constitution, chiefly: “…nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law.” However, it is possible that if a state abortion reached congress that the 1973 could be overturned. The comment says that restricting abortion does not “promote the general welfare [of] Americans.” It is possible that the judges would consider the unborn as Americans (The pro-life argument is that they are future Americans. They would say that even the unborn deserve the unalienable rights and that since the purpose of the government is to protect these rights the law must be changed to allow the unborn to live.), in which case restricting abortion does promote the general welfare.
      The comment also says that “it is not acceptable to force a certain belief or opinion on a community where the opinions clearly differ from person to person.” The government cannot force a belief or opinion. Those are things formed by a person that cannot be changed. However, what they can do is enforce laws that they believe “establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our posterity.” If the government believes that fetuses should have the unalienable rights, they can enforce policies that give them these rights. Most likely, overturning Roe v Wade will not lead to illegal abortions. It will possibly lead to liberal states like California and New York allowing abortions, and conservative states like Georgia and Alabama placing restrictions.

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  12. The issue of abortion has always been a touchy subject among both political parties. However, in this case, both the Democrats and the Republicans are using abortion to bolster support for their own party. Republican politicians who generally abstain from engaging in the debate of pro choice or pro life are now joining the fray, in order to please the demographic of people who support pro life. Conversely, the Democrats are taking the position of pro choice in order to attract people of that demographic who also vote pro choice. However, this leads both parties to take extremes on both positions - either no abortions at all, or unregulated abortions for whoever whenever the woman wants. Both of these extremes are unlikely to ever be passed, as the issue is so polarized among the American people. Both parties need to exercise some compromise in order to find a realistic solution, rather than sticking to their cliques and making a big fuss of how horrible and inhuman the other side is.

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  13. Abortion should be a woman choice. It is their body and no one else's. THey should be able to decide what to do with their baby. There could be many instances where the woman may not be able to afford a baby or did not want a baby, and yet can not get an abortion. It's not worth to give birth to a child that was a mistake or you didn't want. I definitely think life in prison for abortion is way too harsh of a punishment. It should first of all be legal, but if there has to be a punishment, it should not be so harsh.

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  14. I believe that what a woman does with their body should be up to them. Whether they choose to keep the baby or abort it, that should be up to them. There are many cases where people's lives are ruined by having a child because they are not able to support it and it is not the right time in their life to have a baby. What a woman does with their body should not be a decision made by men or anybody but that woman. Forcing a woman to keep a child, no matter the circumstances in which the child was created, is a horrible idea and makes absolutely no sense. Abortion is no way murder or any of the extremes that some people make it out to be. These laws should be considered unconstitutional should not be allowed to be put into effect. Restricting women's rights is one thing, but giving them the most harsh punishment for breaking these laws is just inhumane and unjust.

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  15. I believe abortions should be discussed between both individuals who are in the situation to see what's the best option for both of them. Ultimately I think the choice should be the woman's decision as long both of them come to some sort of agreement. I don't any there should be any punishment for a woman to choose to have an abortion as it's her choice and future it will be impacting. I think especially for situations where the women has been raped or is still a teen, they should be given help instead of being persecuted.

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  16. It doesn't make sense to me that Alabama is allowed to control the choices that woman make. It's an ignorant decision to make 11 year old girls, bear children if they are sexually attacked. I do think that women should bear in mind the consequences of not being prepared to manage having children, but if they never consented, it's not their fault. No matter the case, women should be able to decide if they want to abort their child or not. I strongly object against abortion as a whole, but women have the right to make their own choices and nobody should interfere. It's surprising to see that abortions can receive similar consequences as first degree murder. Unlike other countries, Alabama seems to be a very noticeable outlier and the only state that was actually enforced a law to this degree. Although the law was passed, I don't believe the majority actually agreed to this, but the government forced the law. Hopefully, the law can be considered for change since I don't believe many people ever agreed to restricting the choices women make and their futures as a whole.

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  17. I personally believe that it is a woman's right to choose whether or not to have an abortion. Even if someone doesn't believe in abortion because of personal reasons or religion, that does not mean that they can take that right away from women who need the option, especially in cases of rape, abuse, age, or it simply not being the right time to have a child. People often make the excuse that the baby could easily grow up and become successful, however, this completely disregards the mother who may not have the financial or mental stability to raise a child. They deserve the right to get an education and become successful which may not be possible if the process is disrupted by a pregnancy. For some people it is the right choice, for some people it is not and that's ok. It's all about having the option to do whatever you want with your own body without having others preventing you. With abortions being banned in places like Alabama, women are more likely to attempt dangerous and illegal abortions themselves that could threaten their health. This is why it's absolutely crucial to have trained professionals who can carry out the procedure and make sure women are safe. It is okay if you don't personally believe in abortions and wouldn't get one yourself, but other women need the option because it is the right choice for them.

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  18. I personally believe that abortion is completely a woman's choice. In most cases, when a woman chooses to have an abortion it is because of a reason. Even if someone does not agree with what another person does, it is important to let other people have their own choices especially when it comes to someone's body. No one should get to choose what a woman gets to do with their own body. And if someone claims to be pro-life, they should also aim to helping those already alive who cannot support themselves or don't have a family, etc. No matter what one's personal opinion on the matter is, everyone deserves the right to choice. Not only choice of opinion, but the choice of how to handle one's body and life. Again, as a mother it must be extremely hard to come to the decision of abortion, but there will always be a valid reason behind it and no one is saying everyone will agree, but we must respect every person's right to choice and individual opinion.

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  19. Abortion should be a woman’s choice because it’s the woman’s decision and body. Alabama’s new law should not punish women who choose to abort, because there’s many things to consider when making thatvlife decision. Whether women decide to keep or abort, it should not be allowed for anyone to decide unless it’s the woman. Having a harsh consequence of going to prison is very extreme. The government should not punish someone for making their own personal decision because it’s not up to the government to decide.

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  21. I believe abortion should be a woman's choice for multiple reasons. One of the many reasons is the circumstance that the abortion is going to be taken under, i.e. rape, incest, etc. Abortion should be available no matter what happens and should be an option for the WOMAN who is going to be partaking in the act. The next point I want to bring up is how this bill was passed due to the seven out of eight votes from men. "Of the total 154 votes against in the chambers, over half were from women". This ban is created for women, yet around 321 men are the ones that agreed on the bill. A female lawmaker said: "We do not police men's bodies the way we police women's - and this decision about an issue concerning women so intimately is being made almost entirely by men". Because of these reasons, and many more, I believe that women should have the ultimate decision of having an abortion and the known effect. (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-48262238)

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  22. Abortion is one of the most controversial topics as of right now. I think abortions should be illegal to certain extent. I think that women who have been raped should be excused from consequences regarding this subject. Maybe, women who suffer health problems and may die from a baby should also be excused from the consequences of abortions. However, for the majority of abortions, they should not be excused. The women knows the full consequences of sex which is having a baby. This is should not excused. According to the law, killing a pregnant mother will result in a double homicide. So, having that in mind, killing a baby is a murder and that is what abortion is essentially is. This might sound crazy, but it’s pretty logically sound to have abortion for life in prison since murder lands you in life in prison. However, I think that is a little extreme because I think that the person, whether they killed a baby or a person, should be taught lessons instead of facing consequences.

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    1. To begin, I notice that the comment says abortion is essentially killing a baby and I disagree. A baby is a child from the age of birth to about 4 years old. A fetus on the other hand has not been born yet and is thus different from a baby. Another difference is that in one case, the mother has yet to endure an extremely painful process that alters their body to remove it (the fetus) and in the other, that has already happened (the baby). This key difference is really what pro-choice and pro-life comes down to. Should a woman have to go through with pregnancy? The comment says that they should, because otherwise it's murder, but that is not always correct. Under California Penal Code 187(a), "Murder is the unlawful killing of a human being, or a fetus, with malice aforethought." The key word here is unlawful. In order for this to be murder it must be unlawful and so while killing a fetus (*not a baby) in Alabama might be murder now, in California it is not murder. This example mainly shows how muddled US laws are and how looking at them for guidance won't always show a complete picture. US laws are not a be all end all for moral decisions. Finally, the comment says that women know the full consequences of sex which is having a baby, but I don't understand why that means we shouldn't use abortions. Sex is a physical act that is pleasurable and because of that people might want to do it. In addition, having more sex can ease stress, boost mood, improve sleep, boost your immune system, decrease risk of prostate cancer, improve heart health, “enhance” intimacy, boost cognition, limit pain, and provides a limited amount of exercise. For whatever reason people have sex, the government shouldn’t be trying to force them to live with consequences because of it. We have a solution to to this consequence, and everyone should have the choice to this solution. There is no reason for people to be forced through this consequence. As the comment says, “A person should be taught lessons instead of facing consequences.”

      https://www.nrlc.org/federal/unbornvictims/statehomicidelaws092302/

      https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/01/health/health-benefits-of-sex-parallels/index.html

      Delete
    2. Women yes know the full consequences of a pregnancy but men do as well. If the condom breaks and the man forces her to get an abortion, since the women knew consequences of sex is it on her? If teens are prevented from abortions it will eventually end in higher dropout rates, and illegally and unsafe abortions. Or will she spend the rest of her life in jail?
      - sanya

      Delete
  23. I completely believe that abortion should be a woman's right. Firstly, it is a woman that carries a child inside of her for nine months, not a man. As previously stated by many above, there is a clear distinction between pro-life and pro-choice. Pro-life simply means that a person sticks to the belief that the "government has an obligation to preserve all human life, regardless of intent, viability, or quality-of-life concerns." The later describes the idea that an individual should have rights over their own body, and ultimately it is up to them what they chose to do with it. I feel as though once this confusion is cleared up, many people will see the true root of this problem and where they stand. There are also many myths about abortions that are made up as unsubstantial reasons WHY women get abortions. Firstly, some argue that women get abortions out of "convenience" or "selfish reasons." However when making a decision so impactful as abortion, women have to evaluate many different aspects of their situation, including financial stability, mental state, and physical well-being. If a women is going to carry a baby for the next nine months, she has to be sure that she is not only physically capable of carrying a child, but able to also provide for them for their entire childhood. For many, they have to accept that they will not be able to make a good life for their child, and instead of not only suffering themselves or harming the rest of their family, they choose to have an abortion. And if these new laws claim that not even women should be given control over their OWN bodies, then who else should? At the end of the day, I urge everyone fight for control over their OWN rights and understand that even if an individual does not believe in abortion personally for themselves, DOES NOT mean that they can't be pro-choice, or accept the belief that everyone should have rights over their body and the choice over their actions.

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    1. Firstly, I would like to disagree with the definition of pro-life written. Like almost everything, views on abortion belong on a spectrum. Maybe some pro-life people believe to the extent of that definition, but I do not. I think that all three listed items that are disregarded by pro-life people in the definition are very important.
      Later, the question is asked that “if these new laws claim that not even women should be given control over their OWN bodies, then who else should?” The clear answer to that question in terms of abortion is nobody. A set of laws that I strongly support and that I believe are a good compromise are the abortion laws in Finland (abortion-clinics.eu/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Finland_CB12AB72.doc-Pub_AbortionlegislationinEuropeIPPFEN_Feb2009.pdf). Finland has differents limits for different weeks and I believe it gives enough power to the final while also serving to protect fetuses more the older they get. To conclude the comment, this is written: “I urge everyone fight for control over their OWN rights.” I would like to present the well-known proverb “Open your mouth for those with no voice, for the justice of all the dispossessed.” In other words, stand up for those who cannot stand up for themselves. I believe it is a valorous action to stand up and protect the rights of the unborn, those who were never given the chance to have a voice themselves. Those extinguished before they had the opportunity to live in the open world, walk, talk, laugh, cry, or fight for what they believe in.

      docs.google.com/document/d/1205l8IBEg-eeJ0zuIEXT0dXltjEtksbOqyWEcHN6CWo/edit?usp=sharing
      docs.google.com/document/d/14jrdWKUpT3z7AQgtt7DmJfMqjhYcUPe8ixCGFaNC4N4/edit?usp=sharing

      Delete
  24. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  25. ^^ https://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/data_stats/abortion.htm

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  26. Personally I don't know if I would be able to have an abortion but does that make me authorized to make choices for other women? What fazes me is that women carry a kid for 9 months yet 31 men and ONLY 4 women get a say. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-48262238 They claim to be "pro-life" but putting women in prison for life does not seem pro life. If they were in actuality pro life they would change gun laws, make birth control free to decrease the amount of abortions, or make health care better. These law makers aren't pro life but just looking for another way to oppress women. Many religions have different values, and yes some may argue their religion doesn't support abortions so they vote against it, but I don't believe it's fair for someone else's views to affect another persons life. As the world evolves I feel like everything we are doing is being watched. The FBI know's what we do on our computers, cameras are everywhere. Technology is technology but women should have at least a right to her body. Often women are not ready for pregnancy, are too young or not healthy enough. But placing restrictions upon who can have an abortion also makes it unfair. I think a women should have rights to her own body and instead of voting on laws that make us move backward in time we should focus on more prominent issues, like actual murders with guns like school shootings.

    - sanya buti

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  27. Recently the legislation passed in Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi, as well as numerous other states have been slandered with an onslaught of fury and outrage on social media and the news. Everyone's social media pages were flooded with reposts of posts bashing the new laws and rightfully so. The new laws ban abortion and does not account for instances of rape and incest. In addition, physicians caught performing abortions will be sentenced to prison for a longer period of time that some charges for first degree murder. However, I believe that the large majority of people fail to comprehend what the abortion procedure encompasses. In early stages, a simple pill or minimally invasive procedure can terminate a pregnancy. However, late second term and third term abortions are a different surgery. A hollow tube is inserted into the woman's cervix and a clamp tool is introduced. The fetus' body is then pulled out piece by piece, an arm or leg at a time and put on a surgical rack in order to keep an inventory. The fetus' skull is crushed and pulled out a chunk at a time. I'm not mentioning these procedures to gross people out but it's the truth and once understanding the procedure, we can recognize the backlash. Late term abortions are not only gruesome but in my opinion, unnecessary unless the fetus is the product of an unwanted pregnancy in terms of rape or incest or the fetus is harming the mother's life in a life threatening manner. I can strongly state the I am not in favor of these types of surgical procedures without specific circumstances. However, being anti abortion does not equate being anti choice. My opinions on whether if abortion is moral or immoral does not apply to the millions of women who absolutely have the right to their own opinions and choices. Women are in control of their bodies and the deserve the right to these procedures if they are necessary. The government should not have a say in what choices women make. By understanding the medical and unbiased procedures, we can craft a more comprehensive argument.

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  28. I 100% believe that abortion should be a woman's choice for many reasons, the main one being that they carry the child for 9 months. If the father wants to father the baby but the woman doesn't, it should still be the woman's choice because it is her body that is housing the baby. During that time period, the woman goes through pain, discomfort, periods of lethargy, swelling, and much more that the man does not experience. On the contrary, killing a baby could be considered taking a life. However, whether the woman wants or is able to support a baby is up to her. If there was a way to safely take a very premature fetus out of the body to ensure the mother and baby are not harmed, that is one more life that comes out at the end, and I would agree with that. The baby would just need to go through adoption. That is not the case right now, and forcing a woman to pay extra medical bills to go through delivery, let alone through all of the stress of what to do with the baby, is just not right. Possibly ruining a woman's life to save a baby who would most likely end up in the Foster Care system (which is proven to fail many children, including putting them at a 20% risk for sexual assault according to https://www.fosterfocusmag.com/articles/good-bad-and-ugly) doesn't make sense to me. Some people believe that the mother cannot abort in order for the baby to live (at any stage of pregnancy), and thus abortion laws should be created. However, that is their belief. Whatever the belief of the woman is is entirely different from anyone else's, and she is the deciding factor because she is the one who deals most with the consequences of giving birth and possibly raising a child. Going back to the laws: life in prison and the death penalty for getting an abortion are too extreme. If you are trying to save a life, why would you just get rid of another (via the death penalty)? Life in prison is also extreme because by creating a law that puts the woman through immense stress puts her between a rock and a hard place. There is just no way out of all of the consequences of carrying a baby through pregnancy. If a state were to create laws that punish women that go through an abortion (which I do not agree with), they definitely would need to be less extreme in order to allow the woman to way her options and live her life the way she wants to live it. The way I see it, imposing such strict punishments on women who go through an abortion is taking away their freedom of choice and practically taking away a large portion of their lives (physically, psychologically, financially, etc.).

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  29. If the people of Alabama really cared about the baby itself, then more effort would be put into sex education and birth control to ensure that young people are responsible to begin with. A study from the Washington School of Medicine found that providing accessible birth control allowed a 62-78% drop in abortions compared to national statistics. However, conservative states insist on restricting birth control and sex education as well. Additionally, the foster care system costs the government around $4.3 billion a year. Under this bill, tens of thousands more children will grow up under foster care, costing the national government even more. Also, the almost complete restriction of methods of abortion will not stop women from having them, they will simply turn to unsafe procedures. I myself know not one, but several women that have died from "back alley" abortions because they did not have access to safe resources. All of this taken into account, and the bill seems much more of an attempt to control women's bodies than "save the children".

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    1. Sources sorry
      https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/access-to-free-birth-control-reduces-abortion-rates/
      https://www.adoptioncouncil.org/images/stories/NCFA_ADOPTION_ADVOCATE_NO35.pdf

      Delete
  30. I believe that abortion should be a woman’s choice, no government should not be able to make this choice for people. If the right of getting an abortion is taken away, this will greatly affect people’s life. People choose to get abortions because they may not be able to afford to have a baby right now, unable to care for their dependence, having a child would interfere with their education, or simply that they are too young to be able to care for a child. I believe that if the woman had not chosen to try to have a child at the time, they should not be forced to bear the consequences of that happening. It is vile to see that people are trying to take away one’s right to something like this and that women should be able to make their own choices for themselves as it is their own body and is their own life. To see that they are trying to put restrictive laws with very harsh punishments for trying to get an abortion is uncalled for. I believe that trying to make it so one can get life in prison or the death penalty for an abortion is appalling. Something like first degree murder and abortions should not be held on the same level in the justice system. Also by creating laws on restricting abortion, this will not stop people from getting abortions but instead will cause them to turn to dangerous ways to get an abortion and make then go to lengthy ways to get one.

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  31. I believe that abortion should always be a woman's choice. I think that there's a major lack of understanding in how abortion changes a woman psychologically. A lot of people are convinced that it may simply be some emotionless decision a woman can make and feel no different about before or after. I think that abortions done past a certain point in time are terrifying and that's where even my opinion becomes questionable. I don't think though that governments should be allowed to regulate what choices a woman makes with her body and neither should any other person. Especially when it comes to the 6-week regulation: a lot of women can't even detect signs of pregnancy that early. There are countless sides to this topic and there's always a lot to argue, but at the end of the day it comes down to if the woman can remain healthy and even survive if she is to carry the pregnancy to term.

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  32. I think that abortion should be a woman's choice as they have to bear the baby for nine months and they should not have to take care of the child for those nine months if they do not wish to. It would be unfair to the woman if they could not choose to have an abortion. The laws are to the extreme as there is almost no exception to getting punished by the law if one has an abortion and the punishments are very harsh. Even if this law is enforced, there should be at least some exceptions if the woman did not have a choice in deciding if there was a chance that she would get pregnant.

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  33. I do not think that this law will actually be enforced due to the fact that it goes against Roe V Wade and already has millions of opposers. Regardless, the bill poses an extreme violation of a woman’s autonomy. Pro-life individuals argue that the fetus (not even) has DNA like us and attempt to justify pro-life from a biological standpoint, but, like others in the comments have said, it do not be like that. The fetus could be considered synonymous to a tumor- it is a mass of growing cells that feeds on the living individual and shares DNA with the host. It could be life threatening or benign. My point is, no one should have the power to dictate whether one should get an abortion. Especially not male politicians. A previous comment stated that the politician who signed the bill was a woman, but she 74 years old, and the average age of menopause is 45-55. In other words, she cannot have children anyways, so it should not be in her power to place restrictions on something that will oppress other people. That is like banning books because you are illiterate.

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  34. Kayla Shiao:
    Getting an abortion can be a life altering procedure, which is why, I think, that governments are so restrictive on their abortion policies. Although, I think that women should be able to decide on their own whether or not an abortion would be the right choice for them. 92% of abortions are from unwanted pregnancies, but that leaves 8% that are not. Of the 8% so will be still born fetuses which could be extremely heart wrenching for family to go through with a pregnancy if their child will not be alive when they are born. It could also be extremely dangerous for a to-be mother to go through with a stillborn pregnancy. Being pro-choice does not mean that you support abortions for yourself, but instead you would be supporting other people who think that in abortion is the right choice for them. Despite your medical history, whether you were born because your mother didn’t have an abortion when she was told to or your parents were ready to have a child, I think that every woman should have the opportunity to choose for themselves what they want to do with their body. In addition to that, I don’t think that the punishment for administering or receiving an abortion should be as radical as it is, especially if there is a case of a life threatening situation. Ultimately, this law benefits no one. if women are forced to go through with their pregnancies and are unable to support a child financially or emotionally, they will most likely give up their baby to foster care, which could present future mental health issues. Additionally, if people aren’t getting abortions and end up with a lifetime in jail, the government would have to pay nearly 60,000 dollars per inmate. I think this law should stand as an example of what not to do. Evidently, many people are supporting pro-choice in the media, which is a good way to start the conversation of why abortions should be legal for all women.

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  35. Abortion should entirely be up to a woman. Up until the point that the baby is out of the woman, it is a part of her, it is what she is, when she dies the baby dies. The baby is essentially an extension of her, in fact calling it a baby isn't even accurate. It should be called a fetus. It is absurd to say that the fetus shouldn't be killed off, because until around 5 months the fetus can't even feel pain. Even after the 5 months mark, fetuses are given numbing drugs for the most painless removal as possible. Carrying out the death penalty for an abortion is entirely absurd, because of the fact that women should be able to control what they want to do with their fetuses.
    -rumi

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  36. I believe that everyone should have a choice, especially when it comes to such a life altering decision. While abortions are a risky and emotionally challenging procedure, I think it helps people in many ways. According to shriverreport.org, an organization that specializes in women's rights including abortion and pro-choice, it states that approximately 50% of the pregnancies in the US are unplanned. About 43% end up getting abortions. And in every 1000 women ages 15-19, there are 72 pregnancies, 15 ended with abortion (advocatesforyouth.org). Learning about the new policy in Alabama left me wondering about the unintended pregnancies, including teenage pregnancy, as well as rape victims. Most of these mothers are completely unprepared and were not longing for a child. Without the choice of abortion, they would either have to go through so many emotional and financial hardships, or have to put the child up for adoption or foster care, which can eventually be emotionally and mentally damaging for the child. Most young mothers are not mentally prepared to give birth to or raise a child, which can be traumatic for them considering that they themselves are still children and are still developing. This also made me think of the fact that the legal penalties for doctors who administer abortions are more harsh than a rapist, who has a high possibility of getting a girl pregnant. Although abortions can be interpreted as bad, it helps so many unexpected mothers avoid a life long commitment they didn't even want. I completely agree that abortion should be the woman's choice, seeing it is her body and she has rights. I think that it should be legal for all women, seeing as the choice only affects them, and would potentially help so many unprepared women.

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  37. Abortion should definitely be a woman’s choice, and to be more specific than it needs to be, the mothers. It seems common sense as the fetus is literally is their child which half composed of their genes and almost all of their organelles. What I’m curious about is what is the argument that it shouldn’t be as I can’t think of one. Please enlighten me Aiden. I feel as if the punishments for those associating with abortion in Alabama are just a tad extreme as people have the basic right to do what they want with their body that they’re in control of, and such an extreme for something so basic seems off. There are many different reasons why a women would choose to opt for an abortion and they should be allowed to follow through with their will.

    ReplyDelete
  38. Should abortions be a woman’s choice? In other words, should people be allowed to choose what happens to their own body? I wholeheartedly agree that a woman should be allowed to decide whether or not to have an abortion and I respectfully disagree with the people who chose otherwise for them. A person, regardless of race, gender, or sexual orientation, should be allowed to make decisions about their body without worrying if it’s illegal or not and it should be no different for women and abortion. People abort for many many different reasons, none of them being “just for the fun of it” or because they have another choice that fits their needs better. Some people abort because they’re too young. They might even be our age! We barely can take care of ourselves alone, imagine being responsible for a whole other being that you weren’t even planning for in the first place? Should someone our age have to worry about an unplanned pregnancy while the rest of us are just stressing about finals? What about the people who are raped? Should they have to carry their pregnancy to term and deliver their rapist’s child? Not only is pregnancy a fully time process and physically damaging, carrying around the unborn child of someone who raped them would be more emotionally damaging than words can describe. What happens if you’re financially or mentally unable to care for a child? It’s not the simple matter of “oh just continue the pregnancy and then give the child up for adoption.” For starters, you would have to pay a ton of money for all the prenatal vitamins and doctors appointments and hospital visit when you birth the baby, but also the emotional cost would be extremely high. https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/postpartum-depression-facts/index.shtml states that over 15% of women suffer from postpartum depression and women with already present mental illness are even more likely to contract postpartum depression. Is it right to force them through a pregnancy that could lead to an even further worsened mental health state? Also, pregnancy is a very risky and strenuous thing on a woman’s body. Many people unfortunately suffer from issues with the birth and the nine months before the birth. This all being said, the point of letting a women chose what happens to their body means that they can also chose not to abort if they don't feel comfortable doing that and it’s not the right path for them. They get to choose what path they want to take, not have something forced upon them. Because of all this, I personally think it’s crazy that Alabama is making abortion illegal. I don’t think that a few people in the government should be deciding for all the women of the world. Women shouldn’t be getting jail time for removing something they’re not ready to have. A child is a huge time and money commitment, not to mention love. If a women doesn’t even want their child before they’re born, what do you think will happen to them after? To wrap things up, women should be allowed to choose what happens to them, not others, and they most definitely don’t deserve to be potentially locked in prison from it eiher.

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  39. My body my choice? I one hundred percent agree with women. That it is their body and their choice, and its their choice before the abortion even happens, to engage in intercourse with another person. When a women decides to engage in intercourse she is make a choice/risk of becoming pregnant. So, women do have control over their bodies. Another thing that frustrates me about the pro-choice movement is that they talk about abortion like its a god-given right. It is not. The pro-choice movement also says that getting an abortion is simple, and easy just take a pill and the baby's dead. However, that it is not always the case. Most of the time when a women is pregnant, wants an abortion, and is already in her second trimester . Planned Parenthood uses a vacuum to kill the baby. The vacuum is 35 times stronger than a regular one, and sucks up the baby's legs, arms, head, etc. Ironically, I do believe abortions are necessary in some cases like if the mothers life is in danger, and if the mother was raped. Also I feel that the death penalty, and life to prison is a little extreme but almost necessary in the situation. A life for life in my opinion.

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    Replies
    1. is there a dislike button on comments

      Delete
    2. If you're going to post a comment like this at least leave your name. This is unacceptable, joke or not.

      Delete
  40. Absolutely, I think that abortion should be a woman’s choice. The government shouldn’t be allowed to make laws about choices you make with your own body. However, I know this isn’t the case in states like Alabama. There are no exceptions not even for rape victims, this is absurd because if you are a woman and someone takes your body from you (rape), you are now no longer to even have a say on whether you have a baby you never meant to have. I just disagree completely with these laws. Women should have the freedom to do whatever they want with their bodies even if it angers other people, because at the end of the day it is still their body and their right. Now, the amount of abortion cases could definitely be reduced if people were simply more careful and responsible. The penalty for a doctor who performs an abortion illegally can get more prison time than the actual rapist, and this to me just doesnt make sense.

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  41. Abortion is definitely a woman’s right. Afterall, it is their body, and while the fetus is within the woman’s body, it is a part of her. It is even stated in the bible that a fetus is considered property and not yet life (Exodus 21:22-25). Furthermore, we all know God doesn’t accept adultery and rape, so I find it absurd that the government can take this basic human right without making any exceptions for the victims. It is just an interesting concept how a 6 to 8 week old child has more rights than a grown woman. Furthermore, it is absolutely absurd that the rapist has less punishment compared to the woman who had the abortion.
    (https://ffrf.org/component/k2/item/25602-abortion-rights).

    -Emily Fang

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  42. Abortion is healthcare, and healthcare is a human right. Religious views and personal opinions should not have a say in legal bearing. In addition, only women should be making opinions about women bodies. Instead, the people passing these laws are all men, which have no idea how the woman body actually functions. If these people were truly "pro life" they would be helping homeless, impoverished, and orphaned children. The label "pro life", therefore, would not fit these people. They aren't "pro life" but rather anti choice.

    ReplyDelete
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